When was Jesus born?
In spite of the carol which sings of 'in the bleak mid-Winter' and in spite of any hard evidence regarding the time of Jesus birth it is highly unlikely that He was born in December.
first published 19/12/2010
With the schedule for temple duty fixed in Scripture, Zechariah – in the line of Abijah (Luke 1:5) and allocated the 8th 2-week period of the Jewish year at the end of Tammuz (1 Chron 24:10) – would have been on temple duty around the end of June/beginning of July. (Nisan is the first month in the Jewish calendar.)
It was then that he received divine revelation concerning his wife Elizabeth becoming pregnant (Luke 1:11-13). Six months into that pregnancy (Luke 1:36) Mary was similarly shown that she was to 'be with child' (Luke 1:31).
It is therefore quite probable that Jesus was born in the Autum rather than at the end of the year.
In fact the shepherds wouldn't have been 'in their fields at night' in mid-Winter, nor would Caesar have been likely to have called a census which involved mass travel at that time of year.
'Mouse-over' for the following Scripture references: 1 Chron. 24:10; Luke 1:5; Luke 1:11-13; Luke 1:31; Luke 1:36; Luke 2:7
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Christians Together, 01/10/2013
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Editor |
20/12/2010 22:15 |
The Feast of Tabernacles is indeed a very important milestone. It was at Tabernacles that Jesus chose his moment very carefully to 'go public'. (John 7:8-14).
And it is at Tabernacles that he will 'go up' again (Zech 14:16).
Of the three Ascension Feasts (Passover, Pentecost and Tabernacles) Tabernacles awaits its greatest fullfilment. Passover was fulfilled at Calvary, Pentecost with the coming of the Holy Spirit. But the ultimate outworking of the Feast of Tabernacles will be at the end of this age. Zechariah was shown by God: "The Lord will be king over the whole earth. On that day there will be one Lord, and his name the only name." (Zech 14:9)
For an analysis of the 'crucified Friday/raised Sunday' tradition see -
http://www.christianstogether.net/Articles/148391/Christians_Together_in/Christian_Life/Calvary_hidden_in.aspx
Scroll down to 'Easter myths obscure the true wonder of it all'.
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Martin Lisemore |
22/12/2010 11:19 |
Paul, I didn't make my point at all clear. I must apologise.
If we look at the precision with which God delivered the ordering the Feasts of Ascension, and smaller festivals, the lunar calendar dates at which they are to be celebrated, what should take place etc., we see an annual system of praise and worship, commemorating His past works with the Children Israel, and looking forward to future works. They are His ordinances.
Each Feast stands on it's own as a prophetic utterance. They are a God given framework.
Consider the care He expended to establish and maintain the Sabbath, first as a building block in a seven year cycle, then a forty nine year cycle - the Year of Jubilee.
For the Western church to ignore this precision; ignore His edicts in respect of Feasts and their performance, is an insult to the Host High. It's an act of rebellion, no less.
The institutional church world wide adopted December as the birth of Jesus, and not Tabernacles which is prophetic, and as the Editor rightly said, yet to be completely fulfilled. I know of no Biblical prophecy attaching to December 25th.
Although I enjoy the now diminishing Christian aspects of the Christmas festival, I never feel a part of it. Neither can I condone the sentiment, well, God is just pleased we celebrate the birth of His Son, no matter when we do it. That's not the picture He gives in the Old Testament.
Perhaps some will say, but that's the Old Testament, we live in New Testament times. The answer to that is for another debate.
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Paul Whitworth |
22/12/2010 12:11 |
I agree with you Martin. I'm unsure what I said that you disagreed with.
At Jesus first coming He fulfilled the first three holidays in the Jewish calender. Passover, First Fruits and the Feast of Weeks.
At His second coming He will fulfill the last three holidays, Feast of Trumpets, the Day of Atonement and then The Feast of Tabernacles.
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Annie Morris (Guest) |
03/01/2011 11:26 |
Goodness me, don't you guys love to argue and debate and air your knowledge of the scrptures. I celebrate my Best Friend Jesus'birthday because I love Him and appreciate the amazing grace and unfailing mercy he has shown towards me. I don't think He minds me (possibly) doing this on the wrong date. Does this make me sound like a simple-minded child? - probably! (actually I'm 74) I think the folk who ignore Christmas because the date is wrong are guilty of "throwing the Baby out with the bathwater" and are perhaps a trifle mean-spirited......
I wish you all a Happy, Peaceful and Contented 2011. And hey! lighten up.
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Paul Whitworth |
03/01/2011 12:47 |
Well Annie it could be worse, we could always discuss end time prophesy and deception in the church.
"Baby out with the bathwater" maybe, but I think 'baby Jesus' should have been thrown out long ago. (and was)
Mean spirited? Maybe.
As for knowledge of scripture, or lack of it, this is where many of the problems come from.
Lighten up? Not yet!
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Martin Lisemore |
03/01/2011 23:16 |
Annie, I love you in Jesus.
Annie, I don't think anyone here is so mean spirited; some of us are on a life long quest for truth, having been deceived by the churches for a good part of our lives. We've stripped away the dross, or much of it, and are questing after a Biblical truth, because we believe that is what we'll find in Heaven.
I won't find Santa in Heaven, or Christmas trees, nor Easter bunnies and chocolate eggs. Read on, Annie, it's not so bad.
However, I would not be so mean spirited as to deny you the clearly obvious pleasure of celebrating the Christ nativity in any way you choose. Your heart is so clearly in the right place.
We have a few decorations for our grand children, which do brighten the home; and tinsel around the neck of my lead Border Collie. He took it in good part, but then he'll wear my glasses as well, or even a hat!
My rather off the wall understanding of Scripture is ... the Body is like a symphony orchestra, with the Holy Spirit as the conductor, all bringing glory to Jesus. Our lovely Lord is a Lord of variety, diversity and not singularity. It's a symphony, not a solo. I go with what I've been shown. To do other would be deceitful.
Annie, go with what He's shown you. And that with my blessing.
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Annie (Guest) |
04/01/2011 18:11 |
Thanks guys for giving me something to think about. I was kinda winding you up a little and I loved your generous responses. Paul, I don't quite understand your thoughts about the church decieving me and please explain how Jesus has been thrown out? (My child-ilke attitude is coming out - or is it immaturity?)
And Martin, I know santa and Christmas trees, eggs etc are not a part of the gospel and they are not part of my celebrations..when my grand children (now grown up) asked me why people give presents at Christmas, I said it was because God gave us the greatest gift of all at this time - His Son Jesus, The three "wise men" (or were they astronomers?) gave gifts to Jesus and because of this, it is the season for giving! the fact that it has got out of hand and overshadowed by greed and atheism is not His fault!
I rather like the idea of a symphony orchestra represnting the Body and as such, I will bang my tambourine with even more gusto than I usually do next Sunday. You and your family and your lovely accomadating dog are already "lightened up" Praise God for laughter JOB ch.8 verse 21
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Martin Lisemore |
04/01/2011 23:19 |
Annie, you are a blessing to me. Thank you.
My dog, he's the lead dog of three I have, the most subtle, intelligent and close to me a dog has ever been. He's a fool, like me. A clown. Click on my name above to find a picture of us. I've been a shepherd and worked Border Collies, but this one is the best I've ever known. What a privilege. What a gift.
He has already eaten the tinsel, not to mention a few other things not meant for our dogs. They, I have two more, have eaten several things they shouldn't, including my cap!
What's with the tambourine? Army? Isn't the tambourine a part of an orchestra, an orchestra which needs a conductor for time and direction? And lets not forget the one who wrote the music!
Keep posting my dear, and often, I would love to hear from you. I think you may have much to teach us. So, keep posting, and I for one, will guarantee a reply.
Annie, God Bless you, and that for coming into this life of mine.
Amen.
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Annie (Guest) |
05/01/2011 10:54 |
Oh Martin, thank you for the encouragement - I tried to see your picture but was informed that I "am not authorised to see these details" I would like to correspond with you away from this page, but don't know how to make that happen - I believe we are on a similar wavelength! As for the tambourine - not the Army, I belong to a Pentacostal Church, and we express our love for Jesus however we deem appropiate. In theory this could be noisy and unruly, but in reality, The Holy Spirit keeps us blended into a beautiful melodic sound. Sometimes I'm convinced He brings along a heavenly choir to join in with our rejoicing.
The picture you paint of you and your 3 dogs is just delightful - I have a soft spot for clowns! How sad that there won't be any dogs in Heaven - how about that to start a debate?
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Paul Whitworth |
05/01/2011 14:27 |
Annie, you said 'don't you guys love to argue and debate and air your knowledge of the scrptures.'
And then, 'How sad that there won't be any dogs in Heaven - how about that to start a debate?'
So welcome to the forums, you'll fit in as well as anyone!
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