Christians Together : Clan Gathering 2007

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	Jean Lafferty (Guest)	30/07/2007 15:32
In spite of the mud it was a good week, (wellies available quite cheap ) seminars were good and varied, I specially like J John and would recommend his series on the 10 commandments, a video set in ten of course... Tommy Macneil (C of S minister from Stornoway - Ed.) is a young prophet of our time,who longs for the Lord to have his place now in our nation. He is indeed a blessed man so in touch with his Father and Glorious God in Heaven; so deeply immersed in the Word. A question by J John on who had read through the Bible, brought a response of 20% from the gathering; it was hopeful to know at least some were taking this seriously, even if not quite the many we would hope for; so, we pray on.
	Peter Carr	31/07/2007 05:40
According to J John about 90% of the audience knew a lappsed Christian who used to go to church! Acurate or not, what does it say about how we 'do' church?
	John Parker (Guest)	31/07/2007 12:45
The "lapsed" rate may indeed be a comment on "how we do church" - inasmuch as spiritual people (of all stripes) are recognising the difference between what is "real" and what is merely "organised religion". However Jesus (speaking of "belivers") did say "the love of most will grow cold" (Matt 24:12). There are some strong arguments in scripture which run counter to the doctrine of "once saved; always saved". And the parable of the seed falling into different conditions (Mark 4:3-8) has an application beyond "initial belief".
	Peter Carr	31/07/2007 22:48
"There are some strong arguments in scripture which run counter to the doctrine of "once saved; always saved"'. Interesting comment as I have been born again for about 10 years. I am a 46 year old male who has had his life completely transformed. My understanding, and my assurance tells me that I am totally saved, and no-one and nothing can seperate me from God's love (Rom 8). Also, it is by faith, a gift of God so that I cannot boast (Eph 2). Therefore I do not have any concern about the security of my salvation!
	Editor	01/08/2007 09:46
That's great Peter that you have that assurance. I have moved (copied) the relevant comments to the "Debates" section of the site so that the discussion can go on there. I would encourage all parties to quote any biblical references to support the views that they might hold.
	Editor	01/08/2007 10:13
A site member has commented - The local shops did a roaring trade in wellies...... Appreciated RT Kendal talking on "Forgiveness" (towards others; and appreciating - at a heart level - God's forgiveness for our wrongdoings). He shared that he was exercised for some considerable time about how his ministry perhaps diverted him away from time with his children (as they were growing up). I was concerned however that (in a seminar) he seemed to allow a personal blessing into the lives of his wife and himself to completely change his view on the so-called "Toronto Blessing". (Surely our views - whatever they are - should be principally shaped by Scripture and not experience?) J John brought a very amusing and punchy series of points - including questioning how much we (a) know the Bible (b) pray and (c) how much emphasis do our churches put on evangelism i.e. most churches have praise/worship teams and leaders; how many have evangelists operating at the same level? Mark Stibbe spoke well (but I can't remember what he said). I had (have)some questions about John Paul Jackson's input, but will "park" these for the moment. The praise (I felt) was really just groups of musicians doing what they do - playing and singing. I love to hear Christian voices (in the assembly) singing their praises to God in songs that are familiar to most. More of this please; and less of musicians doing their own material at high volume. Tommy Macneil (in plenary and seminar) brought the "now" word of God to the gathering. In an impassioned way - involving the Word and the Spirit - he brought the heart of the Lord to the gathering. If he is typical of the younger generation of Church of Scotland ministers, then there is hope yet for the body of Christ in Scotland. (the above was submitted to the Editor).
	Sent into Editor (Guest)	03/08/2007 17:45
* Team ministry model is much more effective than one-man ministry * More emphasis on the church being effective in the community rather than simply inside the four walls of the church building * An awareness of more pioneering or cutting edge ministries being raised up by God in Scotland * More Christian leaders are releasing their people to do the work of ministry * God is raising up a new breed of young Christian leaders (The above perceptions relate to the 2007 Clan Gathering and were sent into the Editor by a site member).
	Eddie Williamson (Guest)	08/08/2007 12:00
Interesting point on how RT adapted his understanding of the "Toronto blessing" around his experience and that of his wife. Being at the seminar myself I didn't get the impression personally he had completely changed his mind, merely that he was allowing himself to be taught by that experience and weighed it up against his own understanding of the Lord and his knowledge and experience to that point. I think if we get to the point of being unprepared to be surprised at what the Lord can do, even through people we may disagree with on some theology, then we are in danger of putting God (and ourselves) in a box. The problem with things like the "Toronto" stories often being that Christians like the juicy gossip bits and the weird stories of people doing silly things because they are wanting attention/trying to look spiritual/doing what others do/are actually emotionally out of sorts etc. and we ignore the mostly genuine New Testament (and Church history revival) reflecting work that the Holy Spirit is doing. As for the music - loved it. Part of Clan is learning anew surely? Wasn't every song new for us once?

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